Howard Stern Reveals Why Roger Waters Is ‘A F*cking Moron’ And Lorde Is ‘Shithead’

209
40

Howard Stern ripped Lorde for canceling an upcoming concert in Israel and caving into pressure from Roger Waters and many other musicians.

On his radio show he called the 21-year old singer a “shithead.” According to Consequence of Sound, Stern criticized Lorde for canceling a show in Tel Aviv while still performing in Russia, a country he says is “planting all kinds of problems around the world, all kinds of terrorism.”

“She has no problem with Russia,” he continued. “The only place in the world where she can’t play is Israel. So what do you think’s going on? What’s the one thing about Israel that’s different than all other places. There’s Jews there…I hope Lorde has a good time in Russia.”

Stern also called Waters “a fucking moron.”

Stern interviewed Waters in 2012 before their falling out over Israel. “Israel has a tiny little country and it bugs the shit out of Roger Waters,” said Stern a couple of years ago. “Where do you want the Jews to go, Roger? Where do you want them to go? You want them to just go back to the concentration camp? What is it you want, fuckhead.”

The mere mention of Stern’s name caused Waters to laugh in a 2015 Rolling Stone interview, and he was only willing to say a few brief words. “I wouldn’t waste a single one of my precious breaths on that asshole, and I just did. That was a waste of breath. Let’s move on.”

  • makingconnections

    Howard Stern displays bombastic behaviour and certainly isn’t helping his Jewish brothers and sisters to exist peacefully in the Holy Land especially.

  • Trovoid

    This is a touchy subject. I don’t blame artists for fearing/boycotting areas but it is rather ignorant to avoid one specific place and not the other. They’ll perform in other horrible countries.

    • makingconnections

      I disagree Trovoid. This is a completely unique situation and in my opinion the treatment of the Palestinians is at the root of much of the terrorism in the world. Besides, Stern’s way of speaking doesn’t help his Jewish brothers and sisters one bit.

      • Trovoid

        I will admit that I’m not completely informed on the situation and will take your word for it. I agree Stern comes across as a dick. I guess I just felt that it was unfair to perform in other countries that also have an absolute disregard for any sort of moral compass. Please excuse my ignorance 🙂

        Do you mind explaining to me the exact situation in Israel? I’ve only been able to find vague details about it.

        • makingconnections

          So many of us kind of choose our areas of interest and the information overload is so incredible, no wonder a musician doesn’t understand Israel.

          I’ve always been dedicated to social justice and advocacy for people who can’t defend themselves, so I know a little more than perhaps the average person, but there’s always stuff going on that I’m unaware of. What I’ve come to realize is that there really are no horrible countries, just horrible leaders and the same poor families being victimized by those in power. North Korea is an example of a despised country but the poor souls that live there are in constant fear and are indoctrinated.

          To know more about the current situation in Israel, Googe, “Israeli Settlement”…you’ll be reading for days. You will also find fascinating information about the birth of Israel after WW11, if you look for it.

          What I find troublesome is when Israel is criticized it’s suggested that the person speaking hates Jews. That couldn’t be further from the truth for me. I admire the people and their history and many Israeli’s disagree with their leader’s position regarding the Palestinians…there are protests by Israeli citizens who are against the aggressive stance some are taking regarding settlements in Gaza for instance. I hope you do learn more, you’ll be richer for it.

          • Trovoid

            Exactly. I’m more involved in the realms of psychology, philosophy and music. Social causes and politics are a part-time job. Although I’m fairly passionate about both social causes and politics when it’s something I do know a lot about.

            What you said about there being no horrible countries is spot-on. I always have felt that people are just people, you know? We all want and need similar things in life but we’re confined to our own cultures and leaders. I really feel for those who are ‘victimized by those in power.’ It’s hard not to feel powerless amongst it all. Maybe that’s why I’m so attracted to escapism.

            I’m not surprised it’s suggested that anyone boycotting Israel hates the Jews. Many people twist situations like these to fit their own personal narratives.. Thanks for informing me a bit.
            .

          • makingconnections

            I can picture where you’re at Trovoid….there are only so many blocks of time in a day to inform ourselves and we’re all different in our passions. The areas of interest you have allow you to go so deep and I would think it’s healthy for you. Politics and social justice can be more upsetting with the more you know…it draws you in a different way and then there environmentalism! My God, if only our evolving was just a little more obvious, it would make me so happy. I see it in children all the time….we are evolving, but the old white guys still control so much; actually I believe some of them pull us back by the ankles. That’s enough ranting from me for tonight. I’ve sort of corrupted Alternative Nation!

          • Trovoid

            Yeah, since I’m pretty young still I’m going through a strange phase in life. I’m feeling very apathetic and self-involved as the days go by. Sometimes I feel like we’re all completely screwed but I remind myself that mental illness can warp your brain into thinking the world is worse than it is.. So I try to keep things in perspective. It’s good to be aware of the world around you but I sure have let it all wear me down. I guess all we can do is help out no matter how small the gesture is (whether it’s spreading awareness or donating what you have) and stay steadily detached (without possible empathy overload). I hear you, I’m addicted to this site. I really need to get off here and do something with my life!

          • makingconnections

            Don’t get off this site…I’m addicted to it as well! That’s not the worst you could do, to be on here.
            Actually, I think it’s nearly impossible not to be mentally ill to some degree in the world we live in…it’s become so dysfunctional and we are so more aware of the turmoil than at any other time. I have a friend, a priest who lives in the woods, in his 90’s. He says nature heals us and I’ve always intended to live more simply as he does. He goes to the swamp near his place at dawn and dusk to meditate. He says it’s teeming with life and the sounds bring him to a beautiful place in his mind.
            Have you ever thought of sharing your love of music in some way in a volunteer way. For awhile I did art with people with head injuries and it was a good experience. Sometimes if you start volunteering, it gets you used to getting out there (I don’t know whether you’re working or not, but perhaps it’s not what you want to do.) Anyway, if you volunteer somewhere that you think you might like, it may lead you to something else. You can start with just a bit of time. You mentioned monks at one time….maybe gardening at a monastery or working in a kitchen there. You’ll find your way…maybe need to give yourself a nudge. I’m in a bit of a rut myself, getting over the loss of my only and beloved brother. I think that’s why Chris Cornell’s passing hit me so hard–my brother was kind and good like Chris.
            P.S. I think the Buddhists have a teaching about healthy detachment don’t they?

          • Trovoid

            Oh I know, I don’t mean permanently. I really just need to take breaks from the internet I suppose. It is a comfort to me though.

            Your friend’s life sounds amazing! The thought of living in the woods crosses my mind time to time. Volunteering has been suggested to me before. I actually did volunteer a bit when I was a kid/teenager thanks to my parents. You’re right that it’s good to get out more. I’ve just become extremely reclusive to the point of not feeling comfortable around the majority of people. I’m going to be looking for a job relatively soon and I’m dreading it. I took some time off after my last job and have been living off of savings. I had a very confusing and awful year.. More awful than usual. I’ve been extremely overwhelmed and haven’t been doing much of anything productive. I have projects that I really want to get to.

            I’m extremely sorry to hear about your brother. And I do believe that the Buddhists teach about healthy detachment. I’ve heard of “stoicism” in Greek philosophy which I assume is very similar.

          • makingconnections

            Thanks for thoughts for my brother. He was an amazing person.
            I’m sorry this year has been hard. I remember someone saying once that we have garden times and desert times and both are necessary. I remember that and it helps sometimes. I think if you haven’t been working for awhile that maybe you should get back to it a little at a time so that you get used to the social aspect of being out there again. My friend is a Hermit Priest and he was totally reclusive for years but then got involved in meetings trying to restore a river near his place that was destroyed by mining. He didn’t like it but he turned out to be very good at it and l0 or so years later, the river received the first fish that are thriving there because of the work he did leading a group. They were successful largely because because of his leadership they didn’t approach anyone with anger. He’s now a speaker for environmental causes and much more social than he ever thought he’d ever be…and he’s very old!
            Imagine yourself being much more active by 6 months from now. Hold that picture up to yourself and move towards it. I will hold it up with you.

          • makingconnections

            Hey, have you considered writing…reviews or biographies, even just for yourself. You’re so into music! Who knows where it could lead. Everyone has to start somewhere.

          • Trovoid

            I do love writing. I would consider writing something someday (anything from a book to a film script). My main goal for now is writing music. I have a handful of songs that I really need to finish! It’s been a while, I used to write songs all the time.

          • makingconnections

            Onward and upward young man!

          • makingconnections

            Trovoid, you should delete your posts…let’s do that from now on after we’ve spoken.

          • Trovoid

            Sounds good to me, you read my mind!

          • makingconnections

            What else is new? We’re intuitive in our troll cubicle..haha!!

          • Trovoid

            I was already thinking about deleting them last night because I had a feeling something like this could happen. I guess nowadays people don’t want to have civilized conversations with questions. They have to go right into attack mode. Our kindness and openness is misinterpreted as weakness.

          • A.S.F.

            Geez, why don’t you guys get a room?? Or, maybe you are are already in the same room (or troll cublcle.)

          • makingconnections

            You’re right, we should delete our comments after we’ve spoken personally, which I will do.

          • Trovoid

            Unfortunately, I’d invite her but I don’t have enough space in my troll cubicle. Your mother takes up a lot of space. There’s a slightly less but still outdated joke for you 😉

          • A.S.F.

            And you do that “twist” better than Chubby Checker.

          • Trovoid

            Not sure what you mean by that but that’s sure an old reference. Get with the times. If it was intended to be cruel GFY.

          • Jon Skeed

            Making Connections: It is not all about Israeli settlements. It is about the unwillingness of the Palestinian leadership to negotiate for a peaceful solution. It does not help that the family of a convicted murderer gets monthly payments from the Palestinian Authority and that squares in West Bank cities are named for convicted killers. It takes 2 parties to make peace-not one. They need to sit down and make peace. One side has expressed its willingness (Israel), but the other will not show up (the Palestinians).

          • Helen4Yemen

            You seem to forget that the Jews now in Palestine was transferred to solve the age-old conflict between the Christian West and the Jews of Europe. We the people of the region do not owe European Jewry a dime. They arrived and stole Arab land by force. If you are so generous , give them your land.

          • Helen4Yemen

            Jabotinsky – the Iron Wall – 1923

            “My readers have a general idea of the history of colonisation in other
            countries. I suggest that they consider all the precedents with which they
            are acquainted, and see whether there is one solitary instance of any
            colonisation being carried on with the consent of the native population.
            There is no such precedent.”

          • A.S.F.

            He’ll be reading for days? Jewish settlements comprise barely 4% of the West Bank and there are no-zip-nada–Jewish settlements at all in the Gaza Strip (where Jews cannot step foot, on pain of death–talk about “apartheid.”). In fact, thousands of Jewish settlers were thrown out of their homes in the Gaza Strip by the Israeli government in 2005 so the whole she-bang could be turned over, in its entirety, to the Palestinians…Who responded by increasing their terror and their rocket fire–and then electing Hamas, a jihadist terror organization, to lead them forth in all their hopeful genocidal glory. In 2010, Obama strong-armed Netanyahu (who he insulted at every turn) to cease settlement building for ten months with the promise that he could get Abbas to come to the table to start negotiating unresolved issues face-to-face. Of course, Abbas refused to budge a single inch and Obama failed to deliver. And, of course, Obama doubled down on his pattern of blaming Israel for his failure to get the Palestinians to stop any of their obstructionism and their terror. For years as well as currently, the Palestinians have been building plenty of illegal settlements of their own, in disputed areas, some of which are not so coincidentally located over entrances to terror tunnels and many of which “residences” serve as centers of militant activity. If there were a magic pill to cure hypocrisy, I would say that Israel should offer them to “Anti-Zionist human rights” organizations for free or even pay them to take them on a trial basis. Then again, if, like many other medical advances in the world, if such a drug were to be engineered in an Israeli research lab, BDS would lobby the world to boycott it, on pain of moral (and possibly literal) death. So, the hypocritical “Anti-Zionist” parade marches on.

          • Helen4Yemen

            https://i.imgur.com/GX25PGQ.png

            At 0% Middle Eastern ancestry, what is your connection to Arab land?

      • Jon Skeed

        “the treatment of the Palestinians is at the root of much of the terrorism in the world” WTF????? Why is the Palestinian leadership unwilling to sit down and negotiate peace and for a 2-state solution? Do you think that ISIS, Al Quada and the Talaban have ANYTHING to do with Israel?

        • makingconnections

          I think there are too many Palestinian people living in camps…some living their whole lives in camps. I pray that the world never sees another Holocaust. I do believe that the settlement of Gaza which I understand to be happening contrary to former agreements makes it impossible for the two sides to sit down and try to make peace. Many Israeli citizens feel this way too. That doesn’t mean that I don’t think that Israel has the right to exist or that I don’t respect Jewish people. I know it takes two sides to make a mess of things – they probably have to settle it themselves rather than have other countries intervene.
          Have you ever heard the expression..comes from the Holy Land somewhere: “If you’re going to make war with your enemy, build two graves, one for him and one for yourself.”

          • A.S.F.

            You DO know that the Palestinian refugee Camps were designed and built by the Arab league, who dumped the Palestinians in them after enticing them into fighting losing wars with Israel–and then, leaving them there to rot…right? Oh, maybe you don’t….Just like you don’t seem to be able to notice how the Palestinian governments never seem to get around to making conditions more bearable for the Palestinians still stuck in those camps, despite the tons of “aid” that they receive from all over the globe–more aid, per capita, than any other single group of human beings on earth, as a matter of fact. But they have plenty of money to build terror tunnels and pay terrorist stipends as well as build a multi-million dollar residence for Abbas in Ramallah. He deserves it, right? After all, he is thirteen years into a four year term of office.

          • makingconnections

            You’re very good at presenting your talking points, thinking in terms of black and white and holding up one group of human beings are far more righteous than another. I’ve read all of your posts.

            The State of Israel has been provocative towards the Palestinians for quite some time. They make life very difficult for them by their illegal settlements especially.

            There’s no point in me having a real conversation with someone who’s so into winning and losing and convinced especially that I’m against the Jewish people. I do thank you for not being rude in your comments.

          • Helen4Yemen

            I am going to tell you for the 100th time that Palestine is not your grandmother’s land, is it? I am Middle Eastern and it is not my grandmother’s land, either.

          • Helen4Yemen

            On whose land does “Israel” have the right to exist?

            The case of Palestine is a colonial settler that was inserted itself against the wishes of the native people. It is quite straightforward. The Ashkenazi is 100% foreign to the Middle East region, I am from the region and I aught to know.

            https://i.imgur.com/xy7QQ4P.png

          • makingconnections

            My intuition tells me that you’re probably largely right…I think the guy on the right looks similar to the way researchers say Jesus would have looked. What needs to be considered is that the original people of a country only count for ownership partially at this stage. Look at the situation of First Nations people the world over. They are learning to live with the people that they often welcomed to their land, only to become oppressed by them. If they can do it that maybe the Jewish and Muslim people will find a way as well. The bitterness hurts our children, native and non-native of an area. That is the driving force to reconcile for me.

          • Helen4Yemen

            I am Middle Eastern and I reject any colonial settlers on the land of Palestine that faked their way to that land as “returning”. Please remember that many areas on the Middle East were occupied going back to the Romans, the Crusades, the British, the French, the Italians. But none of them said they were “coming back”.

          • makingconnections

            Well, they didn’t personally fake their way to the new state of Israel. Wasn’t it decided upon largely by leaders of the day after the Holocaust? (mainly Britain, but I’m not a historian) At what time and place do we decide that people have the right to ownership of a place.

            I’m an environmentalist and the way I see it as that we have to share this very small planet that is in big trouble because of all of the poor decisions that we make. It seems ridiculous to be claiming ownership of one piece or another, or considering only the well being of a particular country, when so many are suffering because of floods and fire caused by climate change (usually the poor). We are a crazy lot, us humans.

          • TecumsehUnfaced

            The Zionists started the attack on Palestine in the 19th century, but didn’t get really busy until after the 1919 peace conference.

            Here’s a good set of articles on which I got started exploring the history of Palestine. Just scanning the first one will probably be very helpful to you as it was to me. The author has excellent credentials.

            http://consortiumnews.COM/2014/08/11/the-battle-for-palestine/
            http://consortiumnews.COM/2014/10/23/the-battle-for-palestine-part-two/
            http://consortiumnews.COM/2014/10/24/the-battle-for-palestine-part-three/

            by William R. Polk (->https://en.wikipedia.ORG/wiki/William_R._Polk ), who taught Middle Eastern history and politics at Harvard

          • makingconnections

            Thank you….I will look at this tomorrow. .

          • Helen4Yemen

            The white guy on the left is called “Uri Avnery”, a German Jew who believes God spoke to his people all the way from Palestine and promised Palestine to the Khazars.

          • Helen4Yemen

            That is the wrong comparison. Why go to ancient history? Why not compare one European colonizer of Arab lands – the Ashkenazi – to other European colonizers of Arab land, the French and the British? Compare apples with apples? The French colonized Algeria for over 100 years and 1,000,000 French were forced to leave Algeria in 1962 – and the British who colonized Aden, Yemen, for 160 years were forced out by the people of Aden in 1967. Isn’t the Ashkenaz just as European as the British and the French? If foreign people steal land and there are no consequences to their actions, how do you stop others from colonizing other lands and refusing to go home? The Ashkenazi can very safely return home, he chooses not to only because life is comfy there. Remove the American money by the truckloads that gets sent there and you will see these folks heading towards the airports in a matter of hours.

          • Corndog

            My country has been ruled by a foreign power for hundreds of years now.

          • BigJimSlade

            Then move somewhere else if you don’t like the people running the country. Come to the United States, the greatest country in the world!

            Or if you live in the states and don’t like the “foreign powers” that be, move somewhere else – you’ll be back to enjoy your privileges and entitlements within a week.

          • Corndog

            No, and no. I think i’ll make my own decisions about where i live. Thanks very much for your concern though.

        • Helen4Yemen

          For the same reason the Kenyans did not with the British or the Algerians with the French!

    • swcheetah

      Like where? No one should cross a picket line.

      • Trovoid

        I hate to agree with Stern but Russia is a good example. You know, considering their influence on the US elections.. There are a lot of despicable countries but I’m not even sure that American bands go there in the first place (due to low demand). Since I’ve posted that comment I’ve become a bit more aware about the situation with Israel.

        • swcheetah

          In Mississippi,”Nick Jonas, Demi Lovato, Pearl Jam, Cirque du Soleil, Bruce Springsteen, Bryan Adams, PayPal, and Deutsche Bank are among those who have canceled plans to perform, work, and expand in the states over the recent anti-LGBT laws Nick Jonas, Demi Lovato, Pearl Jam, Cirque du Soleil, Bruce Springsteen, Bryan Adams, PayPal, and Deutsche Bank are among those who have canceled plans to perform, work, and expand in the states over the recent anti-LGBT laws.”

          • Trovoid

            Interesting.. I feel like I’ve heard about that. Like I said before, I feel bad for any of the fans there that have nothing to do with those anti-LGBT laws. I completely understand though.

          • makingconnections

            The U.S. has recently announced that it’s moving it’s embassy to Jerusalem, thereby accepting Israel’s claim the the city. The City has been historically considered the birthplace of both Islam and Judaism…a divided city. This has caused so much turmoil and tensions are rising over the issue.

          • A.S.F.

            Once again, showing your utter ignorance and disregard for the facts. When Arabs controlled Jerusalem (for MANY years), not only was it am absolute backwater, it was an apartheid backwater. Under Jordanian control, no one but Muslims were allowed access, despite the multiplicity of sites considered holy to many different religions…Sort of the way that roving bands of self-appointed Palestinian gangs, under the passive-aggressive eye of the Jordanian Waqfs, prevent anyone but Muslims physical access to the Temple Mount, even on the days and at the times that other people besides Muslims are supposed to be granted access (although they are not allowed to pray–not that THAT should be considered to be “apartheid.”) Arabs and Muslims in the region in question have not been making great strides in expanding the limits of their tolerance. But, then again, “human rights activists” like “Trovoid” and “makingconnections” don’t seem to be too overly concerned about it. You know what they say–“No Jews, no news.”

          • makingconnections

            If you read Trovoid’s posts you’d realize that he’s done nothing but ask questions about Israel. He’s hardly a “human rights activist”. I never thought I’d see the day that such a title would be considered a horrible title.
            Thank you for giving him a better answer than I ever could have on how division makes moving forward impossible and how entrenched we get in our ideas when we lose the ability to “walk in another’s shoes”.
            I fear the war in the Holy Land, that tiny little place on the surface of the earth, will be going on for a long time.

          • A.S.F.

            You and he seem to be an “Anti-Zionist” buddy team who like to appear to have more benign intentions than you actually do. Your attempts to introduce false propaganda in the guise of asking ask “innocent” (and yet, insinuating) “questions” while you “exchange ideas” (which are, suspiciously, all of a piece) is a tactic favored by those who seek to Israel-bash while appearing to be simply championing “the totally injured party”–who are, of course, the Palestinians. It’s an old trick and a not particularly convincing one. The Palestinians are NOT “little Nell” being tied to the railroad tracks by big bad “Snidely Whiplash”, Israel. It is astounding to see so many people buy into that superficial (and yet, cynical) nonsense.

          • makingconnections

            Wow….you have a very active imagination! Trovoid is a musician who is not particularly interested in world affairs. I’m interested in social justice and try to speak against injustice when I see it in my day-to-day life, often concerning First Nations people….I’m of mixed ancestry I tell you proudly.

            Unlike you, I don’t think anyone’s got the truth on their side…we’re all messed up if we’re struggling with each other. To think that the people of Palestine or those that aren’t Jewish are all wrong in their thinking tells me you are lacking in some basic knowledge. Those people floating around looking for a safe haven in the world and dying because of it are there largely because they have leaders and citizens in their country who have oppressed them. They are usually the poor, those that suffer…but not always I realize. It’s the ongoing fighting and black and white thinking that is causing the the stress for refugees; “The Promise” asks us to devote ourselves to helping refugees, especially children. If you find me a threat to your well being because I don’t think Israel is without some responsibility in the strife in the Holy Land, I’d say you don’t understand the very basic fact that it takes two sides to make a war…often many more.

          • A.S.F.

            Ah, so you two DO know each other, eh? I never said that the Palestinians don’t have legitimate gripes and concerns or that they deserve deserve justice or a better life. I would like to see them achieve their own statehood–just not at the cost of Jews having to give up all claim to their’s. It is the Palestinians who keep insisting that the two are mutually exclusive.

          • makingconnections

            Trovoid and I talk on this site, actually since the death of Chris Cornell. I don’t know him in any other way, Mr. Detective. Are you having difficulty with retirement?

          • A.S.F.

            Like I said, you and “Trovoid” obviously knew each other somehow. You weren’t just two random blokes exchanging ideas about this subject for the first time. I am afraid your inferences about “retirement” don’t make any sense to me in the context of this conversation–or anything else.

          • Trovoid

            You’re scum of the Earth and don’t know either of us. You’re making assumptions and blowing this up for no reason. I didn’t know much about the conflict with Israel so I was simply asking another regular on the site about it. Go project your anger someone else, you asshole.

          • A.S.F.

            Who has the “anger issues” now, Trovoid?

          • Trovoid

            Fair enough. I’m just sick of reading comments from overly opinionated, hostile people. Makingconnections and I were simply having a conversation. I didn’t know it would cause this much of a shit show.

          • A.S.F.

            I am willing to take a step back as well. I try to back up my opinions with facts. I hope you will consider the facts that I presented since you seem to present yourself as someone who wishes to learn more about the issue–which entails a willingness to look at both sides of the story. I am afraid you won’t hear that side from the likes of Roger Waters or any of his BDS compadres. I read many different sources (even some which sometimes turn my stomach and make me squirm) because I think it is worthwhile to see things from all points of view. But I have read way too much Anti-Zionist propaganda that borders or crosses over into the kind of hateful dialogue that would make Goebbels proud. That kind of stuff has been dangerous in the past and it seems to be leading too much of the world down the same path again. THAT is a truly frightening thought. Mankind barely managed to pull itself back from the brink of destruction the last time around–and now we have the weaponry to blow our planet to kingdom come. The weapons change but our psychology stays the same. I see history as being human psychology spread out over a timeline. Where Anti-Semitism is concerned, it follows a certain pattern. Anti-Semitism is like the Herpes virus of mankind–it seems to stay in the nervous systems of many cultures and go into remission for varying periods of time but it doesn’t take much in the way of stress to re-activate it. And, as I said before, what starts with Jews as its primary target, never ends with Jews as its only victims. It is a symptom of a larger global disease. Don’t fool yourself–that disease HAS been activated and it has the potential to set the entire world on fire. Again. But even if Jews consented to see the one majority Jewish nation in existence on the entire planet go down the tubes, I can assure you, the destruction wouldn’t stop there. The Palestinians deserve their shot at statehood just like the Israelis do. The sad fact is, they have never, and still do not, prioritize their statehood over their utter determination to make sure that Jews get deprived of their’s. Nothing will change until that sad fact does. As Golda Meir once famously said: “There will be peace in the Middle East when Arabs start to love their children more than they hate Jews.” Talk about a “sh*t show.” That’s a pretty sad one right there. I wish you good day.

          • Trovoid

            I’m not anti-semitic at all. To be honest I don’t really have an opinion on whether artists should boycott Israel or not. If I were a touring artist I’m not sure what I would do. I originally said that this is a touchy subject and I feel bad for the fans who can’t see their favorite artists perform. I have nothing but respect and admiration for all of the Jewish people that I’ve met. Most of those boycotting Israel aren’t racists. I even asked on this thread why artists aren’t boycotting other controversial areas/countries. I feel that people are just people and it upsets me that civilians in countries are immediately stereotyped because of their rulers or politics. As an American, I know what it’s like to deal with those stereotypes. People think you stand by everything that is going on in your country. I wish nothing but the best for the Israeli people and I hope they can overcome their current issues.

          • makingconnections

            Now it seems you just want to argue A.S.F. Let’s quit all of this. How about you go upstairs and ask your wife to make you a nice cup of tea!

          • Trovoid

            I find it hard to believe that he has a wife. I wonder where he ordered her from.

          • makingconnections

            Oh no, he’s had a wife for a long, long time. He’s been telling her how to think forever.

          • Trovoid

            She cooks and cleans, he works. He comes home and angrily grunts until she prepares dinner. He beats her now and then and yells while watching Fox News. Making assumptions aren’t so fun now are they A.S.F.?

          • makingconnections

            Have you heard that Canadian Song – Bachman-Turner Overdrive from long ago called “Takin’ Care of Business”?

          • Trovoid

            No but I just looked it up.

          • makingconnections

            You have an overly-active imagination. We talk on this side about music mostly, but also mental health, education, and on and on, but I also have many other posters who I speak with now and then and love sharing thoughts with them. I consider a know them to a small degree on the Internet. Trovoid and I have never spoken about Israel before and I doubt we ever will again. Really, it’s about the music mostly on this site. Take a look around at the articles.

          • Helen4Yemen

            In 1882 when the Ashkenazi arrived as colonial settlers, they found:

            • 400,000 Arabic-speaking indigenous Palestinian Muslims (78%)

            • 40,000 Arabic-speaking indigenous Palestinian Christians (6%)

            •15,000 YIDDISH-SPEAKING European Jews (3%)

            There are no more Palestinian Jews left anywhere in the world today as they converted to Christianity and Islam over centuries. What “Palestinian Jews” are your referring to? Hungarian and Lithuanian Jews are not called “Palestinian Jews”? Can you name a single Palestinian Jew? I can name hundred of Palestinian Muslims and Christians, how many INDIGENOUS Palestinian Jews can you name?

          • TecumsehUnfaced

            A.S.F. is a true sociopathic Talmudist. She doesn’t care what the truth is. She just wants people to believe her. She won’t talk to you, because she knows that she can’t fool you no matter how astutely she lies.

          • Helen4Yemen

            Do you see the number of comments and how long each comment is?

            These predators have an obsessive need to be in Palestine!

            And I also see way too many comments deleted … which worries me because I have no desire to waste a second of time composing comments only to see them vanish.

          • TecumsehUnfaced

            And those deleted comments seem to be predominantly those arguing with A.S.F.

          • Helen4Yemen

            Yep, I noticed that too.

          • makingconnections

            Alternative Nation rarely deleted comments. They were my comments of yesterday arguing with ASF…..I do that sometimes when I don’t want the anger that I gave in to to stay up, or the disrespect that I indulged in. I always regret getting into it with people who don’t know how to have a conversation.
            I also feel that it’s unfair to get into politics to the degree that I very easily do, because this is a site to discuss Alternative Music and I like the site and the commenters very much. I feel it’s unfair to them to politicize the threads to the degree that we have here.

          • TecumsehUnfaced

            Thank you! Kind of me to tell me that!

          • Corndog

            There is no ‘stay on topic’ rule here MC (can i call you MC?), feel free to talk about anything you want, so long as it’s civil. A little bit of mild name calling has always been accepted as it’s par for the course online but there have been occasions were people have taken it way too far and that is the only time i have intervened. I’ve banned a few people who refused to stop it (i considered it with this A.S.F. person as they are clearly interested in only one thing; and that is to have an argument, to the point where they were just accusing everyone and anyone of being against them and making points that they never even made in the first place. I called them out on it a few times earlier, asking them to point out where i had said some of the stuff that they claimed i said but they of course ignored that request), but for the most part you can discuss anything you like so long as you’re nice about it, and, well, you’re always lovely so i don’t see there being an issue there:)

          • makingconnections

            Thank you for your kindness Corndog (yes you can call me MC…I’m such a woman brought up to be proper that I can hardly type your Moniker!)

            A.S.F. made me very angry and I always feel terrible when I’ve let someone get to me to that degree. Talking with her was a big waste of time. My life has been so much about reconciliation that I’m always feeling that I played a role in anything that goes sideways to the point of being neurotic I think.

            Anyway, A.S.F.’s black and white thinking is an example of why we struggle so much with each other in this world, in my opinion.

          • Corndog

            You’re very welcome:) Yes they got right on my nerves too. Incredibly unpleasant individual.

          • Corndog

            The comments were deleted by the author themselves.

          • TecumsehUnfaced

            He already told me that. But thanks!

          • Corndog

            No worries, and Makingconnections is a ‘she’ 🙂

          • TecumsehUnfaced

            I should have known. Makingconnections seemed very empathetic for a guy (in this patriarchal society).

          • Corndog

            Well i’m a guy, and i like to think that i am a very empathetic person, so i’ll try not to take that as an insult:)

          • TecumsehUnfaced

            I’m a guy too. I just couldn’t resist making the crack.

          • Corndog

            That’s fine man. I wasn’t actually insulted, i was only kidding!

          • Corndog

            Fear not, the deleted comments were deleted by the author themselves, not by the site. Have at it. I’d be very interested to see a debate between yourself and the ever obnoxious A.S.F.

          • Helen4Yemen

            We have known one another for 2 years and the predator stays clear out of my path. I have read her comments to you and in essence they say “remember the holocaust” and that you as a European Christian or your ancestors are responsible and therefore you should not be saying anything about her folks in Palestine unless complimentary. But I am a different story, she cannot point her holocaust finger at me.

          • Corndog

            I had noticed that they did not seem to want to reply to you. I guess they must be a little scared of you! I think they were determined to call me and everyone else in the thread an anti-Semite regardless of what we said. Kept putting words in my mouth, such as saying that i had presumed they lived in Israel when in actual fact i said absolutely nothing of the sort. All i really had to say (after pointing out that i know very little about the situation and could very well be wrong) was that from what i have seen on the news it appeared to me that the Israelis were treating the Palestinians pretty badly. They then tried to make out that they knew the situation in my own country better than i do myself despite having lived here all my life. Go figure…

            I have to say, after reading the things you have posted here (and making the assumption that your facts are correct) i think a lot of it makes sense. What right do the Israeli people have to that land if they are in no way indigenous to it? I never knew that before. I always presumed that they were returning to a land that had previously belonged to them, so thanks for the food for thought. I support the countries right to exist, but not if it means stealing land that does not below to them in the first place. I don’t think that saying that makes me anti-Jew. I have no more issues with Judaism then i do with any other organised religion. I’m a little contemptuous of organised religions in general.

            As for the holocaust, it was a horrible chapter in human history but it had nothing to do with me. The only people responsible for it were the people that carried it out. The Nazi’s and their allies. It is not the responsibility of current generations to apologise for the atrocities of the past.

          • makingconnections

            Corndog, I disagree with you on there being no need for apologies over past wrongs. Personally, I put great value on our leaders apologizing to those who were treated very badly–no not by us personally, but as a people we allowed something very dark to happen. If only we had leaders that could “put out brush fires” when ethnic cleansing and such matters are happening, maybe we wouldn’t have to send our beautiful young people off to war.

            In Canada the First Nations people (I have a native Grandmother so feel very connected to the issue) were nearly wiped out as the largely British leaders who had settled Canada, along with Italians, Irish, French and on and on (we are real melting pot) put them on small reserves and tried to make them assimilate. Children were taken away and put in abusive residential schools and the dysfunction in their families is very sad; however, I believe we’ve turned the corner. I think many younger people are more aware of how difficult it is for some of them and they are becoming more respected generally and the young don’t seem to see colour as much as their parents and grandparents.
            We actually have some amazing things happening here; for instance in Haida Gwai, formerly The Queen Charlotte Islands, a huge tract of land has been rescued from logging and the original people from there have a working government with the Federal Government. They make every decision through complete consensus and it’s worked well for quite a number of years. It’s hoped that it will be a model for other areas.
            By the way, our Prime Minister recently apologized to the First Nations people on behalf of all Canadians and it was deeply appreciated by many native and non-native people. There were many tears among the elders.
            Every situation is different I realize, but when there’s been a real injustice take place and it’s still hurting, an apology is a very good thing for all.

          • Corndog

            I get where you’re coming from regarding governments making apologies for the mistakes of the past, but I don’t believe that individuals should feel responsible for it. I actually had grandparents that fought in the war against the Nazi’s so I feel like my family conscience is clear, if you know what I mean.

            Regarding the situation in Canada, I’m a big Star Trek fan and I read something interesting on a Trek site the other day. Apparently a guy over there had a personalised number plate that had a variation of the word assimilate on it, which was in reference to the Borg (‘you will be assimilated’) from Trek. He was told that this was offensive to the indigenous people and was forced to remove it. There was other Star Trek terminology around the plate so it was clear that it was a reference to Trek so I thought that seemed a bit weird. Did you hear anything about that?

          • makingconnections

            I think what helps the oppressed people is if there’s an apology it somehow helps those of us who weren’t around when it happened to give acknowledgment to these people that they are still suffering because of what happened a few generations ago. It’s not that we are responsible or should feel guilty, but acknowledge that it happened and in our case especially, learn from it. I’ll tell you, these people have resisted! There are many large families and strong families on reserves today, some of them anyway.

            The Star Trek thing is weird but I can see it happening in Canada. We try very hard to be good! Last fall one of the First Nations northern artists was found floating in the river in our capital. A police officer stated on his Facebook page that she was probably drunk. As it turned out she’d been murdered. He was charged…I don’t know the outcome. A bus driver in the East heard a man speaking abusively to a woman wearing a head skarf and stopped the bus and said, ‘if you have a problem with her, you have a problem with me.’ These are the news stories that make many of us happy! It does sound as though the Star Trek thing was a bit much but it shows the degree to which we’re trying to reconcile.

          • Corndog

            I couldn’t find the original video that i watched, but here is a link to a news report about the license plate:

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvjMvpbABs8

          • makingconnections

            I understand how this would seem weird to your but I understand completely. Winnipeg is a big city full of friendly people, many immigrants and a very large downtown First Nations population. There is so much violence, so many missing women….on and on. Resistance is what kept these people from not being completely wiped out and Assimilate is the most ugly word for anyone trying to work on the truth and reconciliation.
            I can understand how wonky it must seem, but it’s a very edgy business, native and non-native stuff here.
            At first I thought it was ridiculous until I saw the plate saying resistance is futile….those that don’t know about Star Trek would hate that statement.
            The BBC has put out a wonderful documentary about the First Nations people of the Northwest Coast where I’m from. I’m so proud of it and there are many others put out by CBC and various other people that are quite inspiring. The best time I’ve ever had in my life, well right up there anyway, was hanging Salmon in the Fall in the Smokehouse with a native friend. We prepared them on the beach first and it was a cold, crisp day and we were silent in our work. I was hanging out with the ancestors that day I think!

          • Corndog

            It does seem weird to me, but i suppose i can see how someone might be offended by it. You really need to take it out of context though. ‘Resistance is futile’ and ‘you will be assimilated’ have been ingrained in pop culture now since at least 1996 when the movie First Contact was released and the wider non-tv Trek public were introduced to the Borg, so it surprised me that anyone seeing it would not realise that it was a simple reference to Star Trek.

          • makingconnections

            I understand…a person knowledgeable of Star Trek would get it and most would not be offended (still maybe some would not want to take the chance of offending), but I know many people of the next few generations up, who don’t follow it at all.

          • makingconnections

            You know the loss of life by the Allied Forces is not considered enough when we talk of defeating Hitler and ending the Holocaust. We Canadians are thanked constantly by the Dutch…the soldiers from Canada, especially when they were younger, visited there a lot because they were the ones that marched in to liberate the people of Holland. It would be nice if we heard more often from Jewish people that they are grateful for the sacrifices that so many families made. We lost a young man in our family who was delivering a message in Belgium when the war ended…the war was over….he was on a motorcycle and he was killed by a sniper from a tall building…very sad.
            I also can’t bear it when people like the current president of the US speak of winning WW11, as though no other country took part in the effort at all. Geez I can’t bear injustice!

          • makingconnections

            Corndog, I’m so sorry about the loss of your Dolores O’Riordan.

            I haven’t done any reading on AN today, but on my way home from town I heard about her loss on our National News. They paid tribute to her in the nicest way, with the Cranberries music in the background.

          • Corndog

            Yeah i couldn’t believe it. I didn’t realise that she was so young too. She was only a few years older than me. She has to be one of the most unique singers i have ever heard. Such power and emotion in her voice. She will be missed!

          • makingconnections

            I once heard an Irish woman sing in a tiny church on an small island where I lived for a long time….she was visiting there. It was a gathering place…not usually used for church any longer…anyway, she had the sweetest and yet powerful voice that I’ve never forgotten. Dolores O’Riordan’s singing was like that. I like “Zombie” in it’s expression of what I feel some of the time.

          • Corndog

            Zombie is great wee song. I think all told though i preferred the sound that they had on their debut album. Always loved songs like How, Dreams, Linger or Still Can’t…

            I actually have the urge to go listen to that album now, but it feels strangely disrespectful to use the news or her death as a prompt to go enjoy some music. I know that sounds bizarre. Can’t really explain it.

          • makingconnections

            You’re an honourable man, that’s why…you’re honouring her with your silence.

          • Corndog

            Thank you. You’re so nice:)

          • makingconnections

            Not to be disrespectful of our conversation but I remember a friend who had a sister from Scotland and her little boy visiting in Toronto. He’d never seen a small person before and shouted in his Scottish accent on the bus: “Oh look Mummy, look at the lovely wee man, and he’s got a lovely wee coat!”
            Children make my world go round.

          • Corndog

            Everything here is wee, no matter how massive it might be. I’m not really sure why we do it to be honest as it’s rarely used to mean ‘little’.

            huge 7 seat 4×4 SUV? That’s a lovely wee car.

            Big looming mountain? That’s a lovely wee hill.

            It’s kinda weird i suppose:)

          • makingconnections

            The Scottish child was using the term literally because he was speaking of a dwarf…..now what you’re speaking of I believe is a word that has become a colloquialism…I think so anyway. (just so we’re edjumacated!)

          • Corndog

            Yes that’s probably the case. Much of our language here is made up of weird colloquialisms that are only going to make sense to us, not to mention our crazy accents!

            A new TV show started here a couple of weeks back that is set in the Irish city of Derry during the early 90’s and i understand that when they broadcast it in England they do so with subtitles:)

          • makingconnections

            That’s fun…accents are fascinating. I always find it interesting that when people are just learning a new language, they use the proper word and it’s completely different speaking with them because we have so much slang usually. I remember saying to 2 Colombian exchange students that I’d had a strange day–their response was a gasp…oh no, what happened? I told them but they were puzzled–it wasn’t strange at all!

          • makingconnections

            Corndog, I have to tell you that it’s been quite wild where I am lately. There are wave warnings and yet the young people are still surfing down the highway from here, among the rocks! It’s been raining hard for weeks–the bulbs are coming up and yet it’s predicted that this weekend our ski hills will have more snow than anywhere else on earth. Drama!
            Do they surf on Ireland’s coast?

          • Corndog

            I honestly don’t know if the folks here surf. I’m not familiar with anyone that does it at any rate.

            We’ve been having some crazy weather the last few weeks too. Some really heavy snow and ice. Driving is a bit of a nightmare at the minute. I was travelling home from my mums house the other night; journey of about 3 or 4 miles, and i had to do the whole thing in second gear at 20mph. Car was all over the place. My nerves were wrecked by the time that i managed to get home. For whatever reason that night, it appeared that they hadn’t bothered to treat the roads. There were abandoned cars all over the place.

          • makingconnections

            Sure glad that this volatile weather isn’t caused by Climate Change!

          • Corndog

            Of course not. That would just be silly:)

          • Helen4Yemen

            If she finds me commenting at Jewish-owned blogs, she wastes no time alerting them and shortly after, I am banned. Of course, she knows where her warnings will be received and where they won’t. Today, I tried to reply to a comment that someone replied to my comment at The Hill and after I typed the first letter came a message that said: “timeout” and then I discovered that many of my comments were deleted. But this is at a blog where I had been commenting without incident for 2 years. Yesterday, someone got scared and they alerted the blog moderator. Oh well, I documented it at this link:

            https://worldpeace365.wordpress.com/2018/01/15/the-hill-deleted-my-comments-what-are-they-afraid-of/

          • BigJimSlade

            “It is not the responsibility of current generations to apologise for the atrocities of the past.”

            Then why whine about living in a country with foreign leaders? This continent would be a shithole if it wasn’t for the settlers and colonizers that have helped make the United States of America the country it is today.

            And bro, you DO sound anti-Semetic. Sounds like you get the accusation A LOT.

          • Corndog

            Nonsense. This is the first time that i have ever discussed this subject online, or anywhere for that matter. I said, once again, that i know little to nothing about the subject but from the evening news it looks like the Palestinians were being treated badly, but sure, that’s anti-Semitic.

            By all means point out exactly where i committed this horrible sin. Good luck with that though, can’t find what does not exist.

          • TecumsehUnfaced

            Don’t let them pull any of that “Holocaust” stuff on you. Insist that they proveit with some real evidence. They always back down, or try to slip you a babble of assumptions.

          • Corndog

            The holocaust was terrible and disgusting, but they are not going to make me feel guilty about it. It was not my fault. I wasn’t even born yet when it happened.

            Seems they have a buddy on this thread now who has also called me anti-Semitic. Apparently it would seem that you can’t say anything even remotely negative about Israel (such as my comment about what i had seen on the news appearing like the Palestinians were being treated quite badly) without being accused of that. It’s bizarre.

          • Helen4Yemen

            https://i.imgur.com/Kt2g3Hl.png

            My DNA region is #26. What is yours?

          • makingconnections

            Wow, you are definitely a member of the World Community. I don’t have anything official to show you, but my ancestry is: English, Scottish, Serbian, Spanish, Italian and Canadian First Nations.

          • Helen4Yemen

            Please understand that the occupation of Palestine is much more painful because we have a European people who claim to be not European but Middle Eastern. Imagine if the Nigerians claimed to be Norwegians and occupied Norway and said they were simply “coming back”? Not only did European Ashkenazi come after Arab lands but also all that is Arabic: food, music, dance, art, dress, you name it, they stole it. They even brought a camel to the US and said the camel was “Israeli heritage”. Just disgusting!

          • makingconnections

            I understand to some degree that it must be very painful. I think injustice is the most terrible thing to live with and too many on this earth have to suffer it. I like to imagine a just future for this place.

          • Helen4Yemen

            As I mentioned, the Arabs did remove the Crusades, the British, the French, the Italians. The colonizer of Palestine arrived after securing guarantees from the most powerful nations on earth. Iraq was destroyed to make this colonial settler of Palestine to feel safer and so was Libya. At the heart of the Syrian tragedy are once again these European colonial settlers, so scared that one day they may be forced out of the region and they are having the American empire knock one Arab nation after another at their request and for their benefit.

          • makingconnections

            I must admit that it bothers me to hear America called: “The leader of the free world” “The greatest country on earth”, all that bragging. They are a nation like any other, with shameful aspects to their history (so much meddling in the affairs of Central America for instance), Vietnam, (sacrificing their beautiful young people), all of it…and yet there’s something to be admired in the way that they keep trying to sort it out…I wish them well. Many of us Canadians are ashamed when our country teams up with the US, in Libya is the most recent example I can think of. Our leadership bragged about “punching above their weight”, and yet they had no idea of what they were doing. We used to be known as peacekeepers militarily, and I hope we get back to it.

          • A.S.F.

            You guys do know that Israel is a more LGBT friendly nations than any other nation in that exists in that area of the Middle East, right? I mean, Hamas actually executes Palestinians on charges of “Homosexuality”, sometimes by machine gun and sometimes by throwing them off roof-tops while tied to a chair–head first.

          • Helen4Yemen

            https://i.imgur.com/HusazPd.png

            At 0% ancestry to the Middle East, what the he11 is your connection to my region?

          • makingconnections

            Too nasty to carry on talking Helen4.

          • Trovoid

            I found out that Chris Cornell played Israel back in 2016. Just curious, was the controversy with Israel as pronounced as it is now? I wonder how Chris felt about all that considering his involvement for human rights.

  • Stone Gossardish

    The next day Waters and a bunch of other released a letter commending Lorde and presenting the position more. Stern has yet to respond to that. He will act like he didn’t even know it happened, because that’s how he and his perm roll.

  • A Wills

    Pardon me, but perhaps you should all learn a little more about Roger Waters and his racist point of view on Israel. This is a man who once compared Israel to Nazi Germany. He shows nothing but contempt for Jews and he’s a sickening individual.

    • makingconnections

      Sources please…it’s so easy to make statements like yours. I’m for a two-state solution and feel that so much violence will settle down when Israel and Palestine make peace, if they ever do. I hope we will come to our senses someday.

      • A Wills

        There’s your source: https://www.theguardian.com/music/2013/dec/14/pink-floyd-frontman-fury-israel-nazis

        Pig shaped balloons with Stars of David on them? But it’s ok, continue to idolize Waters because he wrote some songs that you love. He really is a fucking moron.

        • makingconnections

          Thank you. That’s disappointing. Why do we have to go crazy and speak in such an offensive way…both Waters and Stern are out of line and abusing their positions. They have the ability to make people listen and they’re squandering an real opportunity.

        • swcheetah

          He had a crucifix on that same pig. It was one time/one show only. He seemed to be comparing religion to corporations. Smart guy.

        • swcheetah

          Or maybe you are the moronic one here, this issue has nada to do with Waters as Israel has committed human rights violations for over 50 years. You seem to just want to scapegoat and change the subject. I believe in Israel and they need protection, but they have done wrong too and killed more. I don’t see anything wrong with Water’s comments so you need to explain why you are spreading lies about him implying he said something offensive. That article is propaganda from a slanted site and they TWIST his words EVERY F****ING time. Lame.

          • A.S.F.

            Roger Waters has also gone on the record to say that he blames “the Zionist Lobby” (sometimes he has slipped up and said “the Jewish Lobby”) in the record industry for his not receiving what he feels to be his due as a musician. He also has gone on diatribes about how Bob Dylan is over-rated and he has some bug up his butt about him. Let’s face it–Waters is a narcissistic loon. Maybe his “Israeli Derangement Syndrome” serves a purpose in his life. Maybe it gives him a avenue to funnel his bottomless inner wells of resentment and rage…in a way that makes him feel, ironically, like a self-annointed saint.

          • swcheetah

            Are you Jewish or Israeli? If so, can you be non-biased on Israel’s offenses? Do you feel Joni Mitchell is a loon for her views on Dylan too? Waters deserves a lot of credit for pushing the truth over your petty complaints of being blacklisted which is plausible. If you have the exact quote where he “slipped”, please provide it.

          • A.S.F.

            I freely admit my bias towards Israel which consists of my conviction that the one sole majority Jewish nation on the entire planet deserves to continue to exist, despite the obsessive claims of others who say the opposite…and seek its destruction through any means possible. I love Joni Mitchell–her problems with Bob Dylan seem to have to do with her personal experiences with him (she toured with him during their days with The Band.) Roger Waters seems to single Dylan out the same way he singles others in the music industry that he deems to be part of the “ZIonist cartel” that are personally out to get him and cheat him of receiving his due as a pre-eminent genius in the music industry.

          • swcheetah

            You have REAL issue in the way you interpret criticism of ANYONE Jewish. Are you this immature to do this all the time? Here’s the f**king quote you propagandized,”at Dylan, “I haven’t got time to do an album of Frank Sinatra covers.”

            Waters expanded, saying; “Bob Dylan, for instance, which is weird. You go, “Fuck me Bob, what is wrong with you? Why would you do that?” I guess it’s because he can’t bear the thought of not being on the road and he couldn’t think of anything else to do. I can’t believe he really has an affinity for all that schlock. But maybe he does.” I’m sure you are a nice person at times, but so, so, SO very misguided.

          • swcheetah

            You are propagandizing him non-stop. Obsessed. Show the quote where he slipped. No surprise you took his quotes on Dylan out of context. I posted them in this thread. Be honest in your arguments or you are wasting everyone’s time.

          • A.S.F.

            Abe Foxman, from the ADL, who used to go out of his way to defend Roger Waters from charges of bias, sadly ended up concluding that Waters was, in fact, an Anti-Semite. Article from the Times of Israel” “ADL Sadly Concludes that Roger Waters is an Anti-Semite” by TOI staff (December 12, 2013.) Since you asked for it, this is one of Water’s own comments that back up my previous post (and Foxman’s sad conclusion): “The Jewish Lobby is extraordinarily powerful here ad particularly in the industry that I work in, the music industry and in rock n’ roll, as they say.” I make an effort to not make statements that I can’t back up with evidence. You might want to try to do the same.

          • swcheetah

            You have failed many times in making coherent points like here. He did not “slip” as you concluded. The Jewish Lobby is a proper term. I read that interview and posted it on this article after you took his comments out of context a few times. Dishonesty is your game.

        • swcheetah

          ALWAYS READ COMMENTS IN CONTEXT. You don’t have to agree, but falling for and promoting clickbait is not honest. “The situation in Israel/ Palestine, with the occupation, the ethnic cleansing and the systematic racist apartheid Israeli regime is un acceptable. So for an artist to go and play in a country that occupies other people’s land and oppresses them the way Israel does, is plain wrong. They should say no. I would not have played for the Vichy government in occupied France in the Second World War, I would not have played in Berlin either during this time. Many people did, back in the day. There were many people that pretended that the oppression of the Jews was not going on. From 1933 until 1946. So this is not a new scenario. Except that this time it’s the Palestinian People being murdered. It’s the duty of every thinking human being to ask: “What can I do?”. Anybody who looks at the situation will see that if you choose not to take up arms to fight your oppressor, the non violent route, and the Boycott Divestment and Sanctions (B.D.S) movement, which started in Palestine with 100% support from Palestinian civil society in 2004-2005, a movement that has now been joined by many people around the world, the global civil society, is a legitimate form of resistance to this brutal and oppressive regime.” Roger Waters https://www.counterpunch.org/2013/12/06/an-interview-with-pink-floyds-roger-waters/

          • A.S.F.

            I always know that the “Anti-Zionists” are going off the rails when they fall back on their “occupation/ethnic cleansing/apartheid/blahblahblah…” rhetoric as soon as it becomes obvious that the cold hard facts are not on their side.

      • A.S.F.

        If you are “for a two-state solution”, then you must not support BDS since they do NOT support a “two-state” solution. And every poll conducted in the Palestinian territories to date has shown consistently that a majority of Palestinians don’t support a “two-state” solution either. Maybe you should talk to your Palestinian brothers and sisters and convince them that it might be a good idea to change their minds.

    • swcheetah

      Go away with your nonsense. The guy has Jewish grandkids. You guys LOVE LOVE LOVE to twist his words into something menacing instead of focusing on Israel’s violations. Is this the comparison? “The Holocaust was brutal and disgusting beyond our imagination. We must never forget it. We must always remain vigilant. We must never stand by silent and indifferent to the sufferings of others, whatever their race, colour, ethnic background or religion. All human beings deserve the right to live equally under the law.”

      • A.S.F.

        If Roger Waters does, indeed, have Jewish grandkids, and I were those kids mother or grandmother, I would keep those kids far FAR away from him. Since Waters has been married and divorced four times (suggesting a rather disturbed pattern of interpersonal relationships), it’s quite possible that might already be the case.

        • swcheetah

          You have clear anger issues. Now you are crossing a line implying he is bad for his beloved grandkids. It’s pretty obvious your type can’t comprehend the human rights violations of the Israel governments. It’s not your place to judge another’s personal life, and in this case he sounds fortunate. Let’s see how your love resume looks when you reach 74.

          • A.S.F.

            I am in my sixth decade and have been married to the same person for over 35 years.You have clear issues with assuming too much.

          • swcheetah

            I’ll keep my assumption as you failed to say if you are still in love and happy. Happy people do not judge as you do nor do they only seem to advocate for their ethno-religious group. Seriously, look at your comment on Waters. You seem to think because YOU have been married to same person for 35 years that means success. You are Jewish so Jewish people can’t be wrong or criticized. You really can’t see your arrested development but others can and your comments make you sound under 35. Take some constructive criticism.

          • A.S.F.

            Your post is truly ridiculous. Stick to music.

    • Corndog

      I don’t really want to get into this, simply because i don’t know enough about it but i have read the link that you provided below and it didn’t sound like he was being racist. The balloon thing was inexcusable, but basically it sounds like he is just against the Israeli governments policies towards the Palestinian people. Are you automatically antisemitic if you don’t agree with how the Israeli government treats the Palestinians?

      Again, i stress that i don’t know enough about the subject to really debate it, but from what little i have seen on the evening news about the region, it does appear (at least on the surface, willing to admit i could be wrong) that the Palestinian people are being treated pretty badly over there. So does that mean that i therefore must be antisemitic? I have nothing against jews. I have equal contempt for all religions:)

      • Bruno Sílvio Martins

        Thank you for making sense.

        • Corndog

          It usually happens to me about once a month:)

          • Bruno Sílvio Martins

            Haha, that’s a good thing! 😉

      • A.S.F.

        It is not Anti-Semitic to disagree with the policies of the Israeli government or to criticize them. It IS Anti-Semitic to target the one sole Jewish nation on the entire planet for extinction, while applying behavioral demands and moral judgements t them that you would not, and do not, apply to any other people or nation– including the people who openly lobby for their destruction–or yourself.

        • Corndog

          Who is doing that?

          • A.S.F.

            It’s up to you to look in the mirror and question whether you might be doing that. Too many people are. They dress their latent (or not so latent) Anti-Semitism up in the pseudo-political “emperor’s robes” of “Anti-Zionism.” They might not even notice it before it’s too late and it’s gone too far. And people should take care to notice, for their own sakes. If history has taught us anything, it is that what starts with Jews as its primary target, never ends with Jews as its only victims.

          • Corndog

            I don’t see how anything I said could be interpreted as targeting Israel for extinction? I have nothing against Israel and made it clear that I have very little knowledge of the situation there. I grew up in northern Ireland in the 70’s and 80’s though so I do have some knowledge of what it feels like to live in a segregated society.

          • A.S.F.

            I have read the Irish media sources that are almost always virulently Anti-Israel. Its like the Irish are trying to relate their “struggle” with that of the Palestinians when, culturally and historically, you couldn’t have less in common. Perhaps you feel that having a history that includes resorting to terrorist tactics makes you sympathize with their using them. But they have used terrorist tactics against Jews (as well as assorted other non-believers) since before Israel even existed as a nation. Look up the Hebron Massacre. The rationales the Palestinians use–and that you use to defend them and justify their actions–don’t hold water. Feel bad for them, if you wish. But much of their misery is self-induced and self-perpetuating. You are not going to help them improve their situation by enabling the hateful and destructive attitudes and conduct that got them into their current mess and which keeps them mired in it. Then, there is the question of all the problems they cause to and for their neighbors on all sides of them–I am not just talking about Israel. Egypt blockades them and Lebanon has built a brand new concrete wall to keep the Palestinians out of their backyard. And that has nothing to do with Israel, although you might want to try to make it out as though Israel is to blame for every sin being committed in the Middle East. If Israel fell into the sea tomorrow, I can assure you, sadly, that the Palestinians would not be magically content nor would they suddenly become sane, honest and competent in their own governance. What I fear would happen is that they would dance in the streets for maybe two weeks tops before all manner of extremist Islamic groups and their sponsoring nations would funnel into the area and start fighting it out for power and control. Then, the Palestinians would get to experience a REAL genocide, much like the nightmare that their Syrian brothers and sisters have been experiencing for over six years now (in which more 3500 Palestinians have died, by the way.) They might even look back at their experiences with their Jewish neighbors as the “good bad old days.” Of course, if they dared to express such a thought out loud, they’d be slaughtered on the spot. The real monster stalking the region is not Israel and or its Jews. It;s the tribalism that has characterized the Islamic world since its inception–and which now spreads its tentacles throughout the world. Displacing blame on Israel and “Zionists” for that is a fool’s errand.

          • Corndog

            You’re awfully fond of putting words in my mouth. Perhaps I feel…..? Utter rubbish. I have nothing but contempt for anyone in my country that is or has been involved in terrorism, nor do I condone it’s use in the middle east or anywhere else for that matter.

            I find your use of the word struggle incredibly condescending. You clearly have no idea what life in this country was like for the last 100 years or so; particularly if you’re unlucky enough to be born on the wrong side of the barricades, where police and military colluded with terrorists on one side against the other. Where half the society was treated like second class citizens in their own country. Where peaceful protesters were slaughtered by the military for having the audacity to March for equal rights and then had explosives planted on their dead bodies in an attempt to justify the atrocities committed by the military in the name of the government. Have you ever seen an 11 year old child shot in the face by an over zealous soldier for doing nothing more than attempting to return home from the shop with a pint of milk? I have. Don’t presume to know me, or the things that have happened here when it it clear you haven’t a clue. Anti Israel here huh? Utter, utter nonsense. You can barely go anywhere here without seeing the Israeli flag flying or murals painted all over the place with words of support for Israel. I didn’t read that online somewhere. I see it with my own eyes every day.

            I have used NO rationale to defend the Palestinians or anyone else. I clearly stated that I don’t know a massive amount about the subject and am only going on what I see on the evening news; something I also clearly pointed out that I’m freely willing to admit could be wrong.

            Please stop putting words in my mouth because I have said nothing more or less than you can read in my previous post. I don’t think or feel any of that stuff you just accused me of doing. That all came from you, not me.

          • Trovoid

            Don’t feed the troll my friend. He came on this thread looking to start all sorts of problems. Makingconnections and I are dealing with it at the moment. He’s making more assumptions and generalizations than I can keep up with!

          • Corndog

            Yes, apparently he knows how I think and feel better than I do myself.

          • Trovoid

            That’s what he’s been implying on my end. Like you, I wasn’t extremely informed about the whole deal with Israel. I asked MC about it and we had a conversation that went off tangent a bit. I check Disqus and he’s ranted all over the place. I miss when this site had less crazies 🙁

          • Corndog

            We always had crazies, but they used to be less belligerent and more friendly:)

          • A.S.F.

            Alas, that does not seem to take too much effort, I am afraid…By the way, I don’t live in Israel either. That’s another assumption you and your broad-minded friends made, all on your lonely.

          • Corndog

            Again, you’re putting words in my mouth. I never assumed anything of the sort. I don’t think you live there and I didn’t say that anywhere in this thread. If anything, I figured you were possibly American or British.

            Yes I agree it doesn’t take much effort as you’ve been making erroneous assumption all throughout this thread. Apparently it’s habitual for you…

          • swcheetah

            I wouldn’t guess you live in Israel. I am clear you are close-minded to why the Israel government is being criticized. What is going on RIGHT NOW is like an apartheid situation. Israel has a lot to answer to – especially to the U.S. who will gives about 4 BILLION a year. It’s a cop-out on your part to keep playing the almost victim because of the past of Jewish people. Genocide can happen to any group of people and your concern is only Jewish people because you are Jewish? Lame.
            -“Critics of Israeli policy say that “a system of control” in the Israeli-occupied West Bank, including the ID system; Israeli settlements; separate roads for Israeli and Palestinian citizens around many of these settlements; Israeli military checkpoints; marriage law; the West Bank barrier; use of Palestinians as cheaper labour; Palestinian West Bank exclaves; and inequities in infrastructure, legal rights, and access to land and resources between Palestinians and Israeli residents in the Israeli-occupied territories, resemble some aspects of the South African apartheid regime, and that elements of Israel’s occupation constitute forms of colonialism and of apartheid, contrary to international law.[Some commentators extend the analogy to include treatment of Arab citizens of Israel, describing their citizenship status as second-class.”

          • A.S.F.

            Still assuming i am a “he”, huh? Talk about assumptions…

          • Trovoid

            I always assume everyone is a guy on the internet until told otherwise. You have a point and I will own up to making that assumption.

          • Corndog

            Absolutely guilty of that too. I tend to assume everyone I speak to online is male and American.

          • A.S.F.

            I presume because more than half of what my family could have been doesn’t exist because they were shoveled into ovens or lie mouldering in unmarked graves. I presume because over six million Jews died in less than a ten years period of time in one feel swoop–and that is but one small example of same throughout human history which is repeating itself as the rates of Anti-Semitic activity all over the globe rises precipitously. And the fact that you make comparisons and think you have some right to downplay that alarming reality is shocking, to say the least. By the way, I don’t know where you got that story about a ten year old child being shot in the face for going to store for milk but I have a very easily researched TRUE story about a ten year old Jewish girl who was asleep in her bedroom when a Palestinian teen broke in, with dreams of glorious martyrdom in his head (planted by his ever innocent and benign society and government), who then proceeded to stab that ten year old sleeping Jewish girl multiple times front and back before slitting her throat for good measure. I have lots of stories like that to tell but, alas, people like you always seem to follow them up with …”Yes, BUT….” It seems quite obvious to me that you lack awareness into your own prejudices, let alone a selective view of current events. The fact is, all human beings have prejudices–they are part of the human condition, It’s just that some people are willing to admit to having them and are willing to try to face them–which is the first step one must take in order to effect any positive change.

          • makingconnections

            No one has the market cornered on suffering…in their ancestry or now. I don’t think the world has ever had more communities divided from one another as now…there are young people in Europe giving the Nazi salute once again. It’s deeply disturbing.

            Your provocative words don’t help. First Nations people in Canada are working so hard with non-native people on reconciliation. It’s our only hope for leaving a healthier world for our children.

            It’s my greatest hope that we can stop picking scabs off wounds and maybe addiction and depression will ease up, if we can see a future as a World Community.

          • Corndog

            Ah, I see now. It all makes perfect sense. Your family was wronged so you see evildoers everywhere you look. Anyone that doesn’t agree with everything you say is automatically against the Jewish people. I have said nothing prejudiced towards Jews in this thread. Nothing at all. By all means point out exactly where this took place. I’m happy to wait…. If anything the massive chip on your shoulder is blinding you to your own obvious prejudice against anyone who dares to have an opinion even remotely different to yours and is causing you to attempt to counter arguments the rest of us aren’t even making in the first place. You’re seeing bogeymen everywhere. You might consider seeking professional help for that. A Quick look at your profile shows that you’ve been doing this all over the internet and have gathered 250 flags for doing so.

            As for my ‘story’, I got it from my own senses. As in my own two eyes, and I happened to know them personally on account of actually being related to them. Frankly, I could care less whether a deeply unpleasant person such as yourself chooses to believe it or not.

          • Trovoid

            You weren’t lying. His/her profile has thousands of comments and most seem to be about this subject. I don’t understand why anyone has to apologize or take responsibility for the messed up shit that past generations did (even if one of our ancestors was involved with the Holocaust). It’s unfair to accuse people of all of these ideas you have in your head. I can’t stand people who project their own issues onto others.

          • Corndog

            Don’t waste your time trying to understand them mate. They’re not worth another minute of your time. If they can’t learn how to have a civil conversation here then I might have to consider whether they should be allowed to post here at all.

          • FM KC

            Indeed at this point whoever else was posting in here felt compelled to delete their comments… it turned into this A.S.F using the space for savage propaganda. Wouldn’t you guys consider just closing the comments before he/she/it wakes up and starts all over? I mean Cornell’s in-law being active should do it for today 🙂

          • Corndog

            You do realise that now that you’ve said that A.S.F. will interpret that to mean you’re anti-Semitic? They probably think you’re plotting to bring down Israel as we speak! 🙂

          • FM KC

            I also listen to Waters occasionally which propels me straight off to being a Hamas fighter 🙂 You were lucky A.S.F doesn’t know about Eddie and Waters… your avatar is highly anti-Semitic by all standards!

          • Corndog

            That must be what set them off:)

          • A.S.F.

            …Ah, yes, definitely stalking. You really are earning points for your open-mindedness and tolerance, let alone your good intentions. Not.

          • Trovoid

            I’m not trying to earn points.. And don’t flatter yourself, I didn’t waste more than thirty seconds scrolling. I got the idea pretty fast.

          • Helen4Yemen

            60,000,000 people died during world war 2. Did 6,000,000 Jews die

            during WW2? People have to understand that they had been crying

            6,000,000 way before Hitler came to power and the reason was they

            wanted Palestine.

            1) 1900-06-11 – The New York Times
            6,000,000 living, bleeding, suffering arguments in favor of zionism

            http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?res=9E01E7D61F3CE433A25752C1A9609C946197D6CF

            2) 1918-10-18 – The New York Times
            6,000,000 souls will need help to resume normal life

            http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?res=9B0CE5DB1539E13ABC4052DFB6678383609EDE

            3) 1919-09-08 – The New York Times
            6,000.000 souls in Ukrainia and in Poland have received notice through action and by word that they are going to be completely exterminated.

            http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?res=9B00E0DE153AE03ABC4053DFBF668382609EDE

            4) 1919-11-12 – The New York Times
            6,000,000 jewish souls facing poverty, starvation and disease

            http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?res=9E02E6DC1F3BEE3ABC4A52DFB7678382609EDE

            5) 1936-05-31 – The New York Times
            save millions jews escape from the european holocaust

            http://www.nytimes.com/learning/teachers/archival/19360531petition.pdf

          • A.S.F.

            You took “a quick look at (my) profile”? You know, stalking another poster in an effort to find something you think might discredit them isn’t going to help you make your case. It’s actually kind of creepy. I can see that I hit a nerve. Perhaps the chip is not on my shoulder but on the shoulder of someone a little closer to home. Think about it.

          • Corndog

            I’m a moderator here. I look at every new arrival’s profile, genius….you really do see bogeymen everywhere you look, don’t you?

            I really have nothing further to say to an unpleasant, obnoxious, belligerent, presumptuous person such as yourself. I’m done with you. Not because you may or may not be Jewish. Not because you may or may not be male. Mostly because you most definitely ARE a total arsehole.

          • A.S.F.

            If you are a “moderator” then you know that referencing another poster’s profile as a way to take them down a peg or two or discredit them is not only outside your jurisdiction but against the principles of the task to which you have been assigned. I hope that whoever or whatever entity is in charge of supervising you–as a “moderator”– is taking note of that. By the way, a legitimate “moderator” would not call anyone on the site they are “moderating” a “total aresehole.” That’s not very “moderate”, is it?

          • Helen4Yemen

            If the shoe fits?

          • Helen4Yemen

            I am Middle Eastern, what have I or my Middle Eastern people got to with your “holocaust”?

          • Helen4Yemen

            Did I not tell you before to quit stealing my Semitic identity and stop this nonsense about ‘antiSemitism” regarding a non-Semitic European Jewry? Simply say: anti-Jew. See, easy!

          • A.S.F.

            Roger Waters, for one.

          • Corndog

            Fair enough. I’ll take your word for it.

          • Helen4Yemen

            https://i.imgur.com/DNyi2Bm.png

            Palestine is not your grandmother’s land, is it? Your native land is what they call “European Jewish”, is it not?

          • Helen4Yemen

            I am! White Europeans were forcefully inserted in our region in order to cure the age-old conflict between the Christian West and its Jewry. People need to remember that the Jews Spain expelled wound up in Muslim countries where they were welcome and remained for many centuries. European Jews arrived during the Ottoman period and also during WW2. The Arab Jews lived in relative harmony with their Arab brothers and sisters. We reject this colonial settler state in our region and we want it gone and replanted in Europe.

        • Helen4Yemen

          Take that nation and insert it back on your grandma lands of of Poland

          or Ukraine. Let Ghada Kharmi tell you:

          Ghada Karmi told “Dani Dayan” that he is nothing more than a

          common thief.

          “My national aspirations, you respect them? Do you? The way you
          respect them is by getting out of my land! That would be the best
          illustration of how much you respect my national aspiration. I find
          you fascinating, Mr. Dayan, I really do. I can’t understand how you
          have such self assurance … A man who was born in Argentina,
          whose family comes from the Ukraine, and he is actually wanting
          people – sensible people – to believe that he has some connection
          with my country! There is another point I want to put to you since
          you respect me so much. Tell me – to many people – you despite your
          eloquence, represent nothing other – you and your fellow settlers –
          nothing other than common thieves! You live on stolen land, you
          drink stolen water, you eat stolen fruit, you farm stolen farms.
          Convince me and the audience and the viewers that you are not –
          you and your settler friends – are not common thieves.”
          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rkJ-u95xPF0

    • A.S.F.

      Yeah, Roger Waters is a real paragon in so many respects. He sings self-righteously about money being the root of all evil while he maintains an estate in the Hamptons, where he is embroiled in a lawsuit (one of many that he has started) with his neighbors over their use of what he considers to be his “private road.” And he talks about the importance of peace in the world and gives lectures about how we should all get along, despite his not being able to get along with his own band-mates for five minutes and has been married and divorced four times. What a guy!

      • makingconnections

        Actually, there’s something humourous about a guy judging the relationship issues of people on Alternative Nation….do you realize where you are?!

        • A.S.F.

          Are you actually trying to infer that someone who has been married and divorced four times, no matter who they choose as their partner, doesn’t display interpersonal issues? Waters also sues other people with regularity, including his own band mates, with whom he has battled quite publicly and nastily over a period of many years.

          • makingconnections

            …just laughing…go get your wife to make you that cup of tea.

            I must say that your contribution on Alternative Nation is appreciated by me because we rarely have this sort of conversation and I hope we never do again. Your talk has brought the madness of the world to this place.

          • A.S.F.

            What makes you automatically assume that I am a male? That’s pretty sexist of you–especially on an alternative site, as you. yourself, have pointed out.

          • makingconnections

            Silly me, I shouldn’t assume such a thing. It’s just that when I see frustration, anger, aggression and thinking that if people are conversing they must need to “get a room”, I think “angry old white guy”. That’s my darkest almost racist side showing isn’t it?

          • A.S.F.

            Yes, as a matter of fact, it is. Think about it. You never met anyone who might be construed as a racist (rightly or wrongly) who didn’t happen to be old or White? Shall we add ageism to your sexism and other possible issues of prejudice? Again, you might think about the number of “assumptions” YOU have been making so far (erroneously, as it turns out.).

          • makingconnections

            I thought I was being forthcoming there but you only take it as an opportunity to lecture. I’m done with you.

          • A.S.F.

            You were the one who asked the question, “That’s my darkest almost racist side showing, isn’t it?”–weren’t you? Don’t whine like an injured party because you asked a question and someone had the audacity to give you an honest answer. You can run to your “safe space” now.

          • makingconnections

            Bye Bye….I’m busy wrapping a parcel for a toddler….that’s the reality of this moment and yes, it’s a safe space. May you find something to do that pleases you now.

          • makingconnections

            Who cares what your sexual characteristics are. You’re definitely “uptight outasight!”

    • Helen4Yemen

      95% of world Jewry is white European Ashkenazi who have
      the utmost contempt for the other Jews of color. Yemenite
      children were murdered to be experimented upon. The white
      Jew was trying to create a new drug for sickle cell anemia to be
      sold in America. Sick cell is a genetic disorder that affects
      mainly black Americans. The white Jews said they believed
      the Yemenite Jews had what they called “Negro blood” and
      therefore why go to Africa or anywhere else looking for “negro
      blood” while you have already “negro Jews” from Yemen,
      right? It is vile, it is disgusting. Now tell me when did the Nazis
      resort to such horrors against other human beings? You do not
      believe me? Simply google: “Yemenite children negro blood”.
      Black Jews were destined for total elimination when the white
      Jews forcefully sterilized black women because they did not
      want the idea of too many black Jews multiplying. In one
      decade, the birth rate among black Jews fell by 50%. You do
      not believe me? Google: “Ethiopian women injected with birth
      control”. Now who is the Nazi?

    • TecumsehUnfaced

      Actually, the ZioTalmudist are much worse. The National Socialists never cleared a country of 80% of its people, or bulldozed over 500 of its villages and towns.

  • Diana

    This guy still have a show? Stern‘s an asshole obviously.

  • Helen4Yemen

    Anybody who wants to get a crush course on Zionism, start here.

    https://worldpeace365.wordpress.com/2018/01/14/edwin-m-wright-on-zionism/